Saturday, November 24, 2007

Discuss the Poll Here

Should someone that has come to the understanding of the truths of the doctrines of grace remain in an Arminian or semi-Pelagian Church?

Any further comments or experiences you want to share?


Anonymous said...

I tried to stay in an Arminian church. I thought that when I came to an understanding of the doctrines of grace, that when I told others, would be happy to accept it. Boy, was I wrong. To my surprise, it makes people angry. There is much love in my church and they knew what I believed, and they let me have my say, and they respected my belief, and we got along fine. I would challenge them on certain doctrines, hoping they would study and try and prove me wrong, but I don't think they are interested. I finally decided that I wasn't going to grow much in this atmosphere. I was getting tired of hearing how we limit God, and how we tie his hands, so I set out to find a church of like minded people that understand the doctrines of grace. I found one in our city. I've only been a couple of times, but I'm thinking this is the place for me. Here, God is sovereign. It seems like a much higher level of worship. By the way, I used to be one of those people who became angry when I was told about Calvinism. An assistant at a church camp, had became friends with my son, and was teaching him about predestination and election. I thought I had to straighten them out, so I set out to disprove them. For the first time in my life, I actually studied the Bible, and even learned there are rules of interpretation. God taught me things I had never heard, and doctrines that I didn't even know existed. Anyway, getting back to the poll, the best thing I think for me was to find another church............Bill

Jeff de Ruyter said...

This is a tough one. My family and I attend an Armianian church but we are strong believers in the doctrines of grace. My experience is exactly the same as the comment above however we have not left yet. Though I admit, I usually leave the services very angry.

Anonymous said...

Could anyone really tell me for sure how Ariminian chruches got such a messed up view of grace when the founder of the view was peservance of the saints as far as I know.

Anonymous said...

Could someone tell me what the key beliefs of a arminian church are that make them that way?

Philip@ReformedVoices said...

I know that not all Arminian churches are the same and there are many that I would feel comfortable in. Many of those that I quote in this blog are Arminian: Leonard Ravenhill, AW Tozer, Paris Reidhead. These guys still pushed for genuine conversion and trusted in the work of God in salvation. I am not aware of any popular Arminian preachers with the same focus as those guys but I am certain they are out there.

I think what I and some of those that have posted have had trouble with is the modern seeker-friendly churches and the decisional regeneration practices that are often found in them. God is often pictured helplessly waiting on the sidelines hoping that men, women, and children will make a 'decision' for Him. 'Say this prayer, walk the aisle, you're saved,(sanctification optional).

I think that many of those that attend those churches would say 'that's not my God' if introduced to the doctrines of grace.

Lane Chaplin said...

I grew up SBC Arminian all my life, even though I knew something wasn't quite right even at a young age. I got fed up with lying about God meaning that I got tired of trying to make God out like He is something other than what he is to appease those that don't fear him like they should. I did it for those that considered God an old man that was waiting helplessly on the sideline, rooting you on no matter what you did. It was either continue living a lie or face reality. I had to leave.

Anonymous said...

Hi there. Well, I grew up in a Arminian/Pentacostal church as a child. Recently, I have been listening to a lot of reformed pastors, like Piper and Washer. And I've been reading R.C. Sproul, etc. They are all wonderful!!! Much of my interest in reformed theology was motivated by Ray Comfort's works and (Hopefully, bringing up Ray Comfort will not get me in trouble here.) I was wondering if some of the more zealous supporters of Predestination can explain why this is a "cardinal" doctrine (if it is considered one)? I truly don't know much about this subject. Again, I'm just learning about reformed theology.

Before, I thought all Protestant churches were "reformed" as in the "Protestant Reformation." :)

I will say this. I believe many of the non-reformed churches have been completely fooled teaching decisional regeneration and the "sinner's prayer." In my experience, sin and Hell have been taught in most of the churches I've attended, but they are glossed over in comparison with teachings on total depravity, etc. (I had never heard of "total depravity" until listening to some of the reformed teachers.) On the other hand, many Arminian churches (not that they ever use this label or likely know what it is) are very nervous about the liberalism and heresy of many of the splinter factions in some of the "reformed denominations."

Any comments would be helpful, especially concerning the claimed primacy of predestination in Christian thought. Please believe me, I'm not looking for any theological tussel. I'm sincerely trying to understand this issue. Again, most "Arminian" churches never even discuss this issue, as it it left for the seminary students. So, I don't really know where to begin, other than blindly reading things on random websites. Any comments?

Philip@ReformedVoices said...

Hi there,

Lane Chaplin there above you has some very good videos that may help you in your study of the predestination issue. Just click on his name and it will take you to his blog. RC Sproul is also doing a series on the topic this week here at

Sproul also has books that cover the subject such as Grace Unknown.

I don't mind you mentioning Ray Comfort at all. I am encouraged by his boldness in witnessing and his street preaching. Also, Way of the Master radio is what introduced me to Paul Washer in the first place.

God Bless,

Anonymous said...

Hi. I'm from Germany.
I got converted 2,5 years ago. The first time I heard about predestination was one year ago and I hated that idea. Mainly through Paul Washer's preaching I got on the way of finding out what that calvinism thing really is. Since December of the last year I'm very confident, that it's true.
I think everyone (or at least most) of the people in my church believe in so called free will. I already had a few discussions. I think I won them, but I couldn't persuade these guys. I'm just trying to explain the whole thing in our small group.
I often feel bad about the things preachers say on the pulpit.
Actually I have no problem with people, who don't believe in predestination, but I can't stand people talking about the cross, that proves how much worth man is. The cross proves how WICKED man is!
So, I pray that people will understand calvinism properly and I hope that revival will happen. I love the people in my church, but I'm afraid that someday I can not go with them anymore.
Whatever happens, God is faithful and whatever happens to me will be a great blessing from Him.

In Christ,